Oni2:Slaves of War/Polylectiloquy: Difference between revisions

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thoughts on Muro, simplifying my thoughts on Barabas and Mukade living/dying, refining thoughts on Daodan

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 '''''What is Griffin up to?'''''<br>
+:First we have to consider the fact that the player made a choice in Oni 1 as to whether to spare Griffin or kill him. You can't make a sequel to a game with multiple endings unless you are prepared to write multiple plots and read the first game's save data to see which story to use. I'd prefer just saying that the player made the "right" call and preserved Griffin's life, because an Oni 2 with Griffin is more interesting than an Oni 2 without Griffin; also, Konoko killing Griffin in Oni 1 would not portend well for her when she reaches Imago, and we want her to ultimately be a good guy, not a monster, or oni.
 :Despite the global fragmentation at the time of Oni 2, Griffin has been placed in charge of a new, trans-national agency called Agency RED. Supposedly this name is not an acronym, but simply describes an agency dedicated to solving the highest (red-level) threats to international security, i.e., terrorism. In truth, the agency only has one mission, and what "RED" really stands for is "Restrain or Eliminate Daodan". The term "Daodan" is not public knowledge, and this acronymic expansion will not be found in writing in even the most classified documents in the offices of the world's governments. Why Griffin would be placed in this important position when he was directly responsible for the creation of one of the prime Daodan symbiotes, as well as the actual source of his group's funding, is known by very few people in the world.
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 '''''Did Muro actually die?'''''<br>
-:If not, then he almost automatically would be the villain in Oni 2. He seems past redeeming. At the least, if there's a new big bad dude in town, he will join up with this new guy, all the while planning to overthrow him. But if he doesn't succeed in overthrowing the boss by the end of the game, it makes him seem weak compared to his old self.
+:Many players probably assume that Muro dies at the end of Oni, without really thinking about it. For one thing, Konoko experiences a Daodan surge upon his defeat. This issue is addressed as part of the next question below. Certainly there is no need to assume that, just because a person falls down and doesn't get up, he is dead. Certainly that's not how it works in real life.
-::If that's the case, we may want him out of the way so we can tread new ground. There seems to be little depth that could be built into his character without retconning and making him out to be somehow well-meaning, which seems lame.
+:Another point which we have to consider is which branch to follow in Oni 1's story. Even though the plot turns out the same regardless of whether Griffin is spared, it makes a difference for Muro. Think about it: in the scenario where Konoko killed Griffin and then beat Imago Muro, is it likely that Muro survived, and is it likely that, if he did, he went to prison? It's more likely that Konoko either had to kill him in order to beat him, or else he was KOed, then later he got up and escaped. Konoko is no longer an officer of the law who can turn a criminal in to the authorities, nor does she have a way of getting him to a police station. Whereas in the scenario where Griffin is spared, then shows up and helps out in the fight, it's much more reasonable to assume that, if Muro was knocked out, Griffin would take him prisoner.
+:Again, if we're assuming Griffin lived in Oni 1, then we have a choice between saying that Muro died or that he was captured. As a Chrysalis host, he certainly ought to be resilient enough that he wouldn't die from a thorough beating, and I don't think that Griffin would kill him in cold blood after Muro collapsed, when he had not even advanced to the Imago stage. If that's the case, and Griffin took him into custody, then Muro would probably stay incarcerated forever, even in the midst of worldwide governmental turmoil, or disagreement over which political authority has jurisdiction over him. We should give the TCTF a little credit and assume that they could find a way to keep an Imago caged up.
+:Then it's just a matter of figuring out whether Muro should play a major or minor role in Oni 2. He doesn't seem like a well-rounded character or one that could be elaborated upon. Certainly making him the major villain seems much less interesting than introducing a new villain (or another form of antagonist entirely...). Perhaps Mai can go visit him in prison at some point and they can have a little brother-sister chat, but I don't see Muro's philosophy being interesting enough to fuel the whole plot of Oni 2.
+:One possibility for a minor role is a sort of "side arc" where Muro breaks out of prison and goes on an Imago rampage, and Mai has to stop him. It doesn't require that we build a lot of story around him, and yet it gives him something to do in the sequel.
 '''''Did Barabas or Mukade die? Either could simply have been KOed. We're not told.'''''<br>
-:'''A. "Yes" to Barabas, "No" to Mukade could explain the major [[Daodan#Daodan_spike|Daodan spike]] after beating Barabas but none after beating Mukade. (Assuming killing leads to a Daodan spike, which Mukade himself indicated it did. This hypothesis would also mean that Muro is definitely dead.)'''
+:One question that needs to be answered here is whether Konoko's major [[Daodan#Daodan_spike|Daodan spikes]] only occur upon the death of an enemy Daodan host. We can immediately say that it is not necessary for the enemy to be a Daodan host because of the spike that occurs [[Quotes/Speech#Out_of_control|after defeating]] the room with the Fury and two Strikers in Chapter 7. It's harder to answer whether the spike requires an enemy to be killed, but if we're going to say that Muro lived (see above), then that means that a Daodan surge must not require the death of an opponent, merely victory over him. This answer also gives us the most flexibility in bringing back characters from Oni 1.
-:B. "Yes" to both, and the difference in reaction was that Barabas was semi-Imago and Mukade was not.
+:We could bring back Barabas, although he's frankly a boring character, so I don't see much use for him. It would also be weird if <u>none</u> of Konoko's major enemies die, considering that Konoko is a fairly violent femme in the first game, so if we are going to avoid straining credulity, we should bring back only the most interesting enemies from Oni 1. I would rank them in the following order of priority: Mukade, Muro, Barabas. I can see Mukade adding the most depth to Oni 2, so let's focus on what we can do with him (see Mukade questions below).
-:: But Mukade would have to be semi-Imago to have those powers. So this is not an option.
-:C. "No" to Barabas and "Yes" to Mukade isn't desirable simply because Mukade is so much more interesting than Barabas that it is unfair to give us more Barabas and no Mukade in a sequel.
+'''''What exactly causes those Daodan super-surges? What do they tell us about Konoko?'''''<br>
-:D. "No" to both. The difference in reaction could also be that Barabas was a Daodan host and Mukade was an experiment of Navarre's (but then why does Mukade indicate he and Mai are the same and they both are being replaced by something inside them?). I just don't know what to do with Barabas, but I would love to see Mukade out of armor, as a new man. Whoever he is….
+:Hardy LeBel, in a well-known OCF post, explained that Konoko and Mukade are like super-predators because of the Daodan Chrysalis inside them. He didn't explain what the Daodan surges meant; his post merely explained why Mukade and Konoko were attuned to each other. The superficial answer would be that a surge represents victory over an opponent, like a post-fight rush of ecstasy. That explanation falls flat, however, when you consider that Mukade's defeat did not trigger a surge in Konoko.
-:E. "Don't know" to both. The difference may have nothing to do with who dies and who doesn't. After all, does the (presumably non-sentient) Daodan organism inside Mai know when someone is killed? Perhaps it would, if there was a release of some energy when another Daodan host died, but let's assume that it doesn't know, and see where that leads us. If it doesn't know, then the occurrence of a major spike has more to do with Mai's mental/physical state at the time. It could be pointed out that all three of the "triggers" for the major spikes are the defeat of someone who has something to do with Shinatama. Barabas has just kidnapped her when Mai defeats him, the room of baddies at the end of Chapter 7 are guarding Shinatama/keeping her from Mai, and Muro was the one who tortured Shinatama personally.
+:The deeper question here is whether the Daodan always makes someone into a violent superhuman. If it does, then it makes sense that violence should be rewarded with a rush of pleasure; alternately, the surge may represent a sort of "leveling up" after a successful kill. However, Kerr told Konoko that she would remain true to her nature, just that her final form would be a more resilient version of herself. Also, depending on the goal or "purpose" of the Daodan organism, violent behavior may not be a requisite development at all (see the Chrysalis section on the [[Oni2:Neo-Agriculture]] page). And since Oni 1 is clearly showing that Konoko is not a bad person (at least, if she spares Griffin), then that means that we shouldn't assume her Daodan surges come from a love for violence.
-::I made some interesting points with E above, but I still favor A, because it sets me up for the kind of Oni 2 that I want to write, one where Muro and Barabas are gone and Mukade still lives, and the explanation is a simple one (using E's back-pedaling disclaimer that the Daodan, even if non-sentient, could still detect and react to the death of a host by sensing a release of energy, or a cessation of life of another Daodan organism nearby, therefore, no reaction to Mukade's defeat means he still lives).
+:An alternate possibility is that the Daodan simply advances on its own in random surges. However, each of Konoko's surges occurs right after a fight, which is an unlikely coincidence. Is it possible that the occurrence of a major spike has more to do with Konoko's <u>motivations</u> for fighting? It could be pointed out that all three of the "triggers" for the major spikes are the defeat of someone who has something to do with harming Shinatama. Barabas has just kidnapped her when Konoko defeats him; the room of baddies at the end of Chapter 7 are guarding Shinatama; and Muro was the one who tortured Shinatama personally. Shinatama was the only person Konoko had grown close to ''in her entire life''. Konoko even disobeyed direct orders from her superior to go find her. So it's not so far-fetched to suggest that Konoko is thriving, not on shed blood, but on the removal of threats to her friend.
+:So, to sum up, either Konoko was being rewarded by the Daodan for her violence, or else her power only advanced when she was fighting to save a friend. This stark dilemma could make for interesting elaboration in Oni 2. Perhaps Konoko is not certain herself whether she is a good person, after the things she's done. If she hasn't reached her Imago form yet, this could be a source of great concern to her, as she wonders how she will turn out when she 'emerges from the pupa'. She may not realize that, deep down, she has real compassion; especially after the events of Oni 1, where she mowed down countless enemies and had everyone out to get her, she might feel that she has no choice but to be a cold, untrusting person. More on this later.
 '''''Who really was/is Mukade?'''''<br>