Oni2 talk:Truth Number Zero/Digest: Difference between revisions

::::The two were working close together with the same motivation. It is not really believable that Hasegawa left Kerr in the dark unless Mukade almost instantly corrupted Hasegawa. I don't say the stretch could not work, it's just difficult. --'Dox

:::::6. You seem to overlook the scale/importance of science prisons. The daodan research is not illegal because its whitepapers seem dangerous. (They could have said to tctf oversight whatever they wanted to get founding, relocate after research and use help of eco activists network to spread the daodan, not necessarily very fast.) Instead, the Daodan research wasn't going to happen because of strict tctf. -- Ironically Kerr ended up there anyway but that was to protect Mai. (For the sake of security Griffin would let them implant the Daodan. Not much persuasion needed here. It's rather the rest of tctf (critics) that would would be concerned, calming them midway with idea of cryofreezing. But for the general part Griffin had approval. "A calculated risk.") -- The tctf wouldn't let have them dev the DC freely but now that the Sndicate has a prototype and Muro they are forced to get on par. ("Griffin wanted to make sure we had a match for any weapon the Syndicate ended up with. He's a cold hearted man.") --'Dox

::::::Sorry, but I still don't see what you're getting at with your "theory of strict TCTF/WCG", and I probably missed the point the first time, too. Can you make actual sentences that explain what "strictness" means, instead of just saying "strict" and then winking (sort of)? You're saying "wasn't going to happen because of strict tctf" as if it was a self-sufficient definition of strictness.

::::::Starting Daodan research with WCG support seems improbable enough ("Hi, we have a project that has absolutely 100% nothing to do with mutation, please fund us! And don't look too closely, because otherwise you'll see that it is absolutely 100% about mutation ^_^") - even if you forget Hasegawa's bad record of activism and Zone trespassing (and murder). Perhaps this is what you mean by "strict"? As for "relocating" afterwards and arranging mass production and distribution from scratch - it seems rather hopeless unless those "eco activists" already have genetic labs or at least some large-scale infrastructure (fluffy version of the Syndicate?). It also sounds like a perfect recipe for being tracked down by the TCTF and put into a Science Prison or worse (with full termination of the project).

::::::"For the sake of security Griffin would let them implant the Daodan. Not much persuasion needed here." -- You missed my point. How Griffin convinced the Directorate to greenlight the appropriately named Damocles project is a separate question - in my view the WCG agreed only because they were hedging their risks, and enlisted BGI as their main insurance against both Muro and Mai. My point was about Griffin persuading Kerr. Somehow Kerr was forced to cooperate and make his own niece into a monster - we don't know what Griffin's means of pressure were, but clearly it's not something that Kerr would have done by himself (which you seem to imply by "Griffin ''let'' them implant the Daodan"). Kerr is very conflicted about how unethical/creepy/dangerous the Daodan is. --[[User:Geyser|geyser]] ([[User talk:Geyser|talk]]) 11:40, 21 May 2020 (CEST)

:::::3. Willingly let people die by holding back life science and medical applications (wcg wants reduction of overpopluation) and 5. Bertram were meant as an example that the tctf and wcg is strict on holding research under control on a big scale. --'Dox

::::::You are not detailing your conspiracy theory about Navarre, so I cannot see how it's an example of the WCG's "strict" attitude. For me, it's just a freak science project, and also one with innocent victims, so, PR or not, it makes total sense for the TCTF to crack down on it at the first opportunity. They'd do the same with the Flatline Zombie makers if they knew where to find them.

::::::We are on the same page about the WCG being attached to population control: the BioCrisis establishes the WCG as vital (because it runs the ACCs), justifies martial law (curfews and such), and naturally keeps the people home (where they can be indoctrinated 24/7 through the WorldNet). Overpopulation or not, any radical cure for the toxic threat would undermine the WCG's authority. --[[User:Geyser|geyser]] ([[User talk:Geyser|talk]]) 11:40, 21 May 2020 (CEST)

:::::However, from all the talk we might take note that the prototypes are an important milestone. At this point the DC's potential is clear - either as a "Daodan in a box" (for Kerr) and as "weapon" (for Syndicate/Stumanderung) and is close to the raid event. In your TNZ it is also showes Hasegawa readiness to "leave Mai behind". If you write (or plan for John) any past scenes his one should be included, I think. --[[User:Paradox-01|paradox-01]] ([[User talk:Paradox-01|talk]]) 07:19, 21 May 2020 (CEST)

::::::I detail the scenes that I think need detailing, thank you very much. If I can avoid overstatement (a 100% factual account of "how it really happened"), I will. Blurry memories are fine, verbal accounts are fine, basically anything "falsifiable" is fine (or rather "non-falsifiable", in the sense that you can never know if such a revelation is true or not - it needs to be ''plausible'', no more, no less). For example, I can imagine Mukade's conversations with Hasegawa, but I cannot imagine exposing them as blunt facts, because that would be "too much fact" in Konoko's uncertain past.

::::::Kerr "managed to escape with" Mai, and TNZ does not say to what extent this was wanted/arranged/accepted by Hasegawa or Mukade. Maybe the plan was to let Kerr save Mai (if Griffin didn't insist in weaponizing her, she'd have been in relatively good hands at the TCTF, as per Kerr's initial intuition). At the Syndicate, it was clear that Muro and Mai would have both been raised as soldiers, perhaps with some cruel competition between the two. So it's hard to tell which plan looked best - infiltrate the Syndicate as a trio, and possibly have more flexibility later, or stick to a somewhat simpler (more predictable?) father-and-son operation. That's one thing that Mukade and Hasegawa may have disagreed on and, again, the ultimate "choice" (Kerr's escape) may have been accidental. --[[User:Geyser|geyser]] ([[User talk:Geyser|talk]]) 11:40, 21 May 2020 (CEST)