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Talk:Restless Souls/Technology: Difference between revisions
Talk:Restless Souls/Technology (view source)
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:::Yes, I'm proposing the reverse order of "ghost" -> kanji -> "troublemaker". It's a pretty interesting discovery if true, since Hardy never stated how he came up with the Chinese word. For my in-world suggestion, see the end of [[Oni2:Slaves of War/Overview#Backstory]], but unfortunately it only makes sense as part of my own story. --[[User:Iritscen|Iritscen]] ([[User talk:Iritscen|talk]]) 22:35, 29 November 2022 (CET) | :::Yes, I'm proposing the reverse order of "ghost" -> kanji -> "troublemaker". It's a pretty interesting discovery if true, since Hardy never stated how he came up with the Chinese word. For my in-world suggestion, see the end of [[Oni2:Slaves of War/Overview#Backstory]], but unfortunately it only makes sense as part of my own story. --[[User:Iritscen|Iritscen]] ([[User talk:Iritscen|talk]]) 22:35, 29 November 2022 (CET) | ||
::::Oh, I see. You mean how Hasegawa: 1) recognizes that Earth is being invaded by alien life; 2) embraces this invasion as unstoppable; 3) sees self-alienation as the only way for Mankind to survive (by blending in); 4) engineers the Chrysalis as a tamed/mitigated manifestation of alien life. Trope-wise this hits a major pet peeve of mine (almighty aliens of doom) but name-wise you have me wondering whether a scientist that's fully aware of such an invasion would label it as "trouble". I mean, a 捣蛋鬼 kind of troublemaker is either a mischievous "trickster" entity, or at most a powerful "agent of chaos" who disrupts the established world order so that a new order can emerge afterwards. If a hostile biome is consuming our planet, and won't stop until it's done, then it feels more like a bona fide doomsday threat - something you'd call Flood, or Sea Of Corruption, or Green Cancer. So I am not convinced that Hasegawa would have used "Daodan" in reference to such apocalyptical trends. By the way, a genius scientist averting the apocalypse with a long-term plan is another potentially sinful trope, especially if this a secret part of the story that you'll have to dump on the reader/player in huge blocks, late in the game. I prefer a narrative that doesn't hinge on big revelations, and a truth that works in layers and can be revealed gradually if at all. Key concepts and motivations should allow for "naive" interpretations (both simple and relatable), and they should be available early in the story, even if there are huge plot twists in store. In that sense I still believe TNZ and SoW can be reconciled (eventually; and probably with quite a few adjustments) as different interpretations of the same multi-layered truth. --[[User:Geyser|geyser]] ([[User talk:Geyser|talk]]) 00:22, 30 November 2022 (CET) | ::::Oh, I see. You mean how Hasegawa: 1) recognizes that Earth is being invaded by alien life; 2) embraces this invasion as unstoppable; 3) sees self-alienation as the only way for Mankind to survive (by blending in); 4) engineers the Chrysalis as a tamed/mitigated manifestation of alien life. Trope-wise this hits a major pet peeve of mine (almighty aliens of doom) but name-wise you have me wondering whether a scientist that's fully aware of such an invasion would label it as "trouble". I mean, a 捣蛋鬼 kind of troublemaker is either a mischievous "trickster" entity, or at most a powerful "agent of chaos" who disrupts the established world order so that a new order can emerge afterwards. If a hostile biome is consuming our planet, and won't stop until it's done, then it feels more like a bona fide doomsday threat - something you'd call Flood, or Sea Of Corruption, or Green Cancer. So I am not convinced that Hasegawa would have used "Daodan" in reference to such apocalyptical trends. By the way, a genius scientist averting the apocalypse with a long-term plan is another potentially sinful trope, especially if this a secret part of the story that you'll have to dump on the reader/player in huge blocks, late in the game. I prefer a narrative that doesn't hinge on big revelations, and a truth that works in layers and can be revealed gradually if at all. Key concepts and motivations should allow for "naive" interpretations (both simple and relatable), and they should be available early in the story, even if there are huge plot twists in store. In that sense I still believe TNZ and SoW can be reconciled (eventually; and probably with quite a few adjustments) as different interpretations of the same multi-layered truth. --[[User:Geyser|geyser]] ([[User talk:Geyser|talk]]) 00:22, 30 November 2022 (CET) | ||
:::::For the record, I'm still very non-committal about this whole reconciliation process :-p But just to clarify a bit, the idea is that the organism (or process) that is xenoforming Earth is labeled "Daodan" by Hasegawa when he discovers its effects. He then invents the Daodan Chrysalis to harness its power so that humans can evolve in the same direction that the ecosystem is going. | |||
:::::So Hasegawa doesn't see the Daodan as a destroyer (once he realizes what it's doing), and the Chrysalis is his agent of change working on behalf of humans. Unlike the WCG which is desperately trying to hold the status quo together and suppress the truth, Hasegawa knows that implanting people with the Chrysalis will help break the government's hold on information, technology and the world. So "troublemaker" seems appropriate to me. | |||
:::::P.S.: Don't forget that my "aliens" are an alternate branch of intelligent life on Earth, probably from the past. If Hasegawa recognized that the Daodan was terrestrial in origin and was simply restoring Earth to a prehistoric state, even more reason why he would not see it as an apocalypse but as a challenge to be met. That being said, I hadn't specifically planned to represent the Daodan-changed Wilderness as being regular prehistoric life but rather as the mutated, supercharged flora and fauna that Hardy had in mind originally. So admittedly there's some tension between the idea that the Daodan is remaking the Earth to be suitable for the "Daomen" from the past and the idea of monstrous killer deer and giant man-eating plants. If I had to choose between the two ideas today, I would probably say that I prefer to pull back on the fantasy angle and stay closer to how these plants and animals looked hundreds of millions of years ago. Then again, it's also possible that the Daodan, as an unnatural invention meant to rapidly create a natural environment, has gone haywire and is doing things it's not supposed to do. In that case, the life it creates might be a little of column A and a little of column B. --[[User:Iritscen|Iritscen]] ([[User talk:Iritscen|talk]]) 02:12, 30 November 2022 (CET) | |||
[[Category:Oni 2]] | [[Category:Oni 2]] | ||